brent metcalfe excommunicated brent metcalfe excommunicated

As a personal friend and research assistant for both Steve Christensen and Mark Hofmann, Brent Metcalfe watched the whole episode unfold right before his eyes. Liked by Brent Metcalfe Experience Practice Lead - Mergers and Acquisitions/Investment Group and Consultant Backswath Management Sep 2022 - Present6 months Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Seeking New. And how was it working with Mr. Ritner? Best wishes, Brent! I know about the September 6 and there are others. How was Christensen reimbursed or rewarded by the Church for his document ventures? At one point John asks you if you think JS was putting together a scam or if you believe that he believed it himself. Release Calendar Top 250 Movies Most Popular Movies Browse Movies by Genre Top Box Office Showtimes & Tickets Movie News India Movie Spotlight. I struggled in school with learning how to read for years and this resulted in me developing crippling anxiety any time I was aced to read in public. The Gift of the Mormon Faith Crisis Podcast. Excellent question. I was hoping you would have spoken more about the Book of Mormon and Abraham. Brent Metcalfe is definitely one of my favorite interviewees ever on Mormon Stories Podcast. [4] He grew up a member of the LDS Church in a devout family, and served a mission for the LDS Church. I believe Brent said he has the copy in his records.**. Thanks for the clarification. It seems like in the aftermath of the bombings, combined with his zeal to argue the history of Mormonism, Brent Metcalfe was excommunicated from The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. My good friend Matt Christensen digitized the 7th East Press and was kind enough to allow Signature Books to make it available on their incredible digital library. As for the photocopy of Wilford Poulsons parallel, yes, I still have it in one of hundreds of boxes in a storage unit while my house is being remodeled. An anonymous source reported that Roy Doxey, then the director of church correlation, wanted to know about the papers Metcalfe was studying at the Church Historical Library, which were on Elias Smith and others. In 1539 he was elected as an MP for the rst time and was appointed to serve in the King's Privy Chamber. It was stillbecause it all drove from the incredibility of the whole thing. Talk about ADD. But it has not always been that way or worked in his favor. We were both greenies at the same time. Reminds me of the Mormon interpretation of Amos 3:7 (Surely the Lord God will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets). Steve Christiansen was my bishop in that centerville ward and I grew up with his children. Thomas, I can assure you Im living on the same planet you are. Learn how your comment data is processed. Like I said they were casting that net as wide as they could get it. My examples are numerous and heart breaking. Thanks again Brent! Thanks so much for posting this. I thought Brents response to this question very touching and informative and dont see that his research should be discredited. ping anser putter 85068 value; italian village commission. Also, the rest of your experience is so totally mind-blowing-interesting. I was pronouncing words instead of just reading them. Brent H Metcalf, 71 Resides in Salt Lake City, UT Lived In Sandy UT Related To Kyle Metcalf, Molly Metcalf, Kristy Metcalf, Nicole Metcalf Includes Address (3) Phone (4) Email (3) See Results Brent Charles Metcalf, 55 Resides in Lowell, AR Lived In Modesto CA, Oroville CA, Bonney Lake WA Also known as Gary Brent, Metcalf Brent Is there going to be a part 3? The look of Jesus on me removed the burden of my sins, while he spoke these words, Be faithful until death and this shall be thy place of rest. I never had seen Jesus Christ before, nor heard his voice, nor ever had a sense of his intercession at the right hand of God for me till now (Billy Hibbard, _Memoirs of the Life and Travels of B. Hibbard, Minister of the Gospel_ [New York: J. C. Totten, 1825], 23). There are so many parallels between the happenings in my LDS life and Brents, (although nothing to such depth and notoriety) I was drawn to find more information about his life, while he was in the church and out. Metcalfe believed that his firing was because of a few people in church leadership who perceived him as a threat, even though he viewed his own work as apologetic and not scholarly. Brent Metcalf, who has been through personal tragedy, triumph and uncertainty can now call himself a national champion. She is professor emeritus of history at Read more Now, in the wake of 200 years of such scholarship, the Bible doesnt hold up much better than the Book of Mormon. He could have never imagined the true extent of Marks crimes, though. I was a newly returned missionary at BYU when all of this took place. You know, guilt by association. The irony is, I wasnt an activist for anything, I simply wanted to write. Tom Phillips, Simon Southerton, Brent Metcalfe, Jeremy Runnells, Grant Palmer, etc. Would that fit the time frame the book is given in? Awesome. In Part 1, Brent talks about his early days in the Church and his time working for Church security. We should also mention that he has since been a key speaker at a conference hosted by Ex-Mormon Foundation and has given several interviews where he has detailed his lifes ups and downs. Its done. I just looked down at the paper and I felt this wave of total anxiety come over me and then all of a sudden it was like my brain stopped working and it felt like I was looking at a different language. Thank you for sharing it with me. I would love to hear more about what unfolded after Hoffman, including how you came to be excommunicated, if you care to share that. Brents words deepened my own thoughts on God, spiritually and humanity. Ive followed Mormon stories for several years now and listed to most of the episodes and this interview with Brent Metcalfe is in my top 5 MS podcasts. I teared up with Brent during that part. If God will ultimately judge us all, why are mere mortals judging mortals, with the illusion of acting for God? So sorry Maxine! Phooey to that. Shortly after returning home and leaving the church he was very active in Sunstone and various things of that nature, but has since moved on with his life and seems very happy with a small family of his own running a small restaurant he and his older brother own together. In Part 3, Brent discusses the aftermath of the Hofmann murders, including the trial and Hoffman's eventual plea deal. Brent, thank you so much for doing this interview! Today the church has suffered too many blows to its claims of certainty to dare to treat its members the way it treated Brent Metcalfe. brent metcalfe excommunicated. Thats what I expected from church leaders.I meanSalamander spirit !! Wouldnt it have been more humorous to wait until *after* the issue was mailed out before bringing the Metcalfe is Butthead acrostic to the attention of FARMS authorities? I heard this in contrast to the snippet of Steve Christensens wife on a news show asking about what Steve Christensen was threatening Mark Hofmann with if he didnt produce the McClellin collection where she stated something along the lines of He was going to go to the police and have him arrested. The confessionals in the documentary of Hofmann's associates, such as Shannon Flynn, Brent Metcalf and George Throckmorton are captivating. You seem to be back on your game of simply inviting your guests to tell their stories. Its probably best to start over when these things happen, rather than just continuing where you left off. Career Two-time NCAA and Big Ten Champion three-time all-American first wrestler in Big ten history to earn Outstanding Wrestler at the conference meet two straight years (2008, 2009) career winning percentage of .972 (108-3) ranks second all-time at Iowa 2008 Dan Hodge Trophy winner 2008 Jesse Owens Big Ten . [9][10] His father was the managing director of the Temple Department for the LDS Church. Now that the new Netflix documentary Murder Among the Mormons has come out, it also validates the important witness that Brent was in this event. but he threw out the baby with the bath water as if the success of Christianity rode on the success of Joseph Smith.. Are there still more episodes of this series on the way?? But such intellectual issues didnt play a role in my failure of faith. and our pigella miraculous ladybug power. Well also talk about the recent history of BYUs Maxwell Institute and what he sees in its future and in the future of Mormon apologetics overall. Do as I say and not as I do. This was something I surmised most of my adult life. No one believed that any one person could do all of those forgeries and build those bombs, and kill those people . by Brent Metcalfe November 24, 2014 14 Comments Jan Shipps is the perfect inaugural interview for the Mormon Studies podcast. Oh, that would be great! Thanks, John and Brent! The 7th East Press was a gem. After admiring the glory of the Lamb for some time, I began to think of the situation my body was in, and rose up to return home. For one thing, you were damn good at martial arts. Thanks for the clarification, Brent. Thank You for contributing your experiences with us all I am curious this morning about the possibility of any reports during the time JS says he had his First Vision, that were published in local newspapers, town Crier printings? In the highly anticipated follow up to our first interview, Brent Metcalfe continues his story. I have been thinking nonstop about that analogy, because it is so illustrative of the disorder. Few people had more of a front-row seat than Brent Metcalfe to the goings-on surrounding Mark Hofmann, the Salamander Letter, and the tragic events of October 1985 what would be dubbed as the Mormon Murders.. Hinckley never responded, but was shortly thereafter offered the job by Christensen, which Metcalfe felt was orchestrated by Hinckley. I was in a mission conference in Bolivia when Steves younger brother was called out and told of the murder. In fact, Brent was with Mark the night before he caused the first explosion. It seems to me that going with what you may think everyone around knows is right (even if it isnt) more easily allows for these kinds of experiences more than realizing there are differences of opinion and thought and then vying for spiritual confirmation. And I went through a very long phase of just wishing that I had never been born.. Brent Metcalfe is definitely one of my favorite interviewees ever on Mormon Stories Podcast. After all, we are human! I can hardly wait for the rest! When Brent Metcalfe compiled a book of essays last year suggesting that Mormonism's founding scripture wasn't the ancient history it purports to be, he expected some criticism. Sandra was criticized by some Mormon Stories listeners for not being as critical of Christianity as she was of Mormonism. Growing up in the Eleventh Ward, you seemed very different than the Terry, Larry and Scott group. So yes, Brent, please comment on this phenomenon. Download . I love the podcasts. Sincerely, Terry. Very informative. I devoutly attended BYU in the mid 70s. https://egyptianalphabetandgrammar.blogspot.com/. Near the end of a presentation you gave for the ExMormon Foundation, you said something to the effect of: People ask me how Joseph Smith wrote the Book of Mormon, how he pulled it off, how it all came about. I shared this source with Mike Quinn when he was writing _Early Mormonism and the Magic World View_. Part 1 of the interview stuck much closer to home for me. Carl, in parts 3 & 4 of the interview, Ill discuss the BoAbr and some of the challenges that believing scholars face in analyzing its ideational and textual origins. Brent Metcalfe, Sue's husband of 23 years, is doing everything he can to support both Sue and Samantha. Im sure this applies to other beliefs as well. Interested to hear about your mission, did you serve in Wandsworth at all? Thanks again Brent, no wonder you have had the experience you have shared with your faith about God. What advice does Brent have for aspiring Mormon historians? going back ten+ years when we first interacted online (message boards), but this interview gave me many more insights. Who does he think the last bomb was meant for? Please let us know. He also talks about his early forays into Mormon studies. That makes more sense. This is one that definately left me wanting more. Why didnt Mr. Metcalfe publish his long-anticipated book disproving the Book of Abraham? This is definitely a not-miss interview. And how many. If youre familiar with image editing, straying from objectivity reminds me of having a color cast in a photo. She has become the matron saint of Mormon studies (that's a promotion from her previous role as the den mother of Mormon studies). Brent did a marvelous job of creating a context by which these events took place. Biography [ edit] As a prep wrestler, Metcalf went undefeated with a career record of 228-0, won four consecutive Michigan state titles, and earned six junior national titles. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michigan_relics. Historian Brent Metcalfe says he was fired by the church out of fear he'd publish something they didn't like. Privacy Policy. This negative sentiment is perhaps made up for by Hofmann's victims. I was nervous that you belonged to the catalyst crowd and relieved to hear your developed belief, or non belief. Pardon me for not commenting on LDS church history, but to be honest Ive read it or heard it all and have moved on. Im with you on the music Charles!! In another post Ill comment on the Mark Hoffman affair. 2023 Cinemaholic Inc. All rights reserved. :( Will re-record hopefully soon! Do you still believe in God, and what type of God? Leave a Reply Cancel reply. I do remember after my baptismal interview having a strong feeling of love and admiration for him because someone so respected thought I was special too. Thank you so much for the story and the insights. I especially connected with his comments on ADD. But are there any podcasts that go deeper in to Gnostics, esoteric teachings, metaphysics, etc. According to Krakauer, the letter said something to the effect of, Mark wont talk to you, but I will, and you definitely want to talk to me. That response introduced Krakauer to the Laffertys and gave him the story he needed to animate what he considered his analysis of radical faith. And Im speaking as a believer- in the very traditional sense- in the Christian interpretation of the world. Steven Christensen (son of Mr. Mac), one of Mark Hofmanns victims. Thank you so much for being so open and honest that particular issue. It was fascinating and enlightening to see the underbelly of ongoings between church leaders and members. It was awful so stressful. Is it paramount to understand all of these religious histories and come to terms with them or, Brant for people like you and me, would it be better to turn our talents toward uncovering and deciphering Gobekli Tepe, a stone temple complex built 12,000 years ago at the end of the last ice age in Turkey, built by the Watchers of the Book of Enoch and the Anunnaki gods of Sumerian tradition? Brent's review of challenges to traditional approaches to the Book of Mormon. I hope to move on some day as well. I am quite sure, that film is no longer shown. The gift of your ADHD shines. What about your book did the church find cause to excommunicate you? We also talk about the concept of translation, Joseph Smiths views on his translations, the traditional apologetic responses concerning the Book of Abraham (Hugh Nibley, John Gee, and Kerry Muhlestein), as well as the LDS Churchs recent essay on the Book of Abraham. Unintended consequences here we come! Why do you think the church is so fearful, silencing members and burying facts ? It is something that has fascinated me, and this Metcalfe interview did not disappoint!!! Brent is a fascinating interview for Mormon Stories for many reasons, including: He knew forger and bomber Mark Hofmann personally. All it is is a continuation of the pain, Brent further added. Good clarification, Doubting Thomas (if that is your real name), :) I have no reason to believe that Jerald Tanner attempted official contact, so Im not sure who Darrick is referring to or what the method of communication entailed. That was fascinating, thank you. Brent was ultimately excommunicated for editing/authoring this book. brent metcalfe excommunicated. Before Mark Hoffman was exposed as a forger, was there anything that made you wonder how he managed to make so many great finds? o David Wright was excommunicated for apostasy in April 1994 for his nontraditional views on Mormon scripture as exhibited in essays like his chapter in New Approaches to the Book of Mormon. As soon as we can! Ive heard there might. Brent is a fascinating interview for Mormon Stories for many reasons, including: Please post your questions for Brent here. Wow John, what an interview. I remember being troubled by the lack of divine discernment that the brethren have/had. @BHMetcalf. Thank you for this interview. The interview was superb and the insight into this extraordinary life was gifted. Certainly the reality, was different than the accepted narrative. [9] According to Metcalfe, he had written a letter to LDS Church leader Gordon B. Hinckley, disputing the grounds for his termination. I've debated whether or not I should write about this, as I'm well aware the reception may be inflammatory, however it's something I'd like to get off my chest. When discussing some of the details surrounding the Book of Abraham, he mentioned the Tale of Onidas and Kitumen. I have never heard of that before and cannot find anything about it. My life has been enriched by theinquiries those books catalyzed. Charles, I dont think I threw the baby out with the bathwater since my examination of the Hebrew and Christian scriptures resulted in the same intellectual concerns that I had with LDS scriptural extensions. Or at least, Lets Take this Puppy Down.. Examples would be projects at the Serpent Mounds in Ohio, linguists studying things like Native Americans singing in a language that seemed close to Hebrew,archaeological digs in latin America that were obviously BOM related, etc. 2) It seems to me that most of the critiques in the 21st century arent recent developments, rather they already existed for sometimes decades (credit to Brodie and the Tanners for that). Lex, you might be interested in the work of Lance Owens. http://mormonstories.org/brent-metcalfe-hofmann-bombings-excommunication-book-of-mormon/, Scan this QR code to download the app now. If I applied Vatican II to the full breadth of Catholicism, I clearly misspoke (Im not even sure why I would make such a sweeping claim, so I am a tad mystified). After years of palling around with anti-Mormon apostates (e.g. It is those moments of intimacy that really help me connect to the humanity of the interviewee. All things praised God with me. About a year or so ago when I finally left the church I looked him up to get advice and catch up on old times. Yes, because remember that the paradigm speaking through Mikes words is not just representative of him. Really, such a great family. Thank you, I didnt know about that info. Again, Im not sure that you would disagree with any of this. How have things changed over the decades? It seems like in the aftermath of the bombings, combined with his zeal to argue the history of Mormonism, Brent Metcalfe was excommunicated from The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Honestly, incredible work. Daniel Kahneman speaks in terms of efficient Thinking Fast biases that unconsciously deploy the WYSIATI (What-You-See-Is-All-There-Is) heuristic, which has proved itself sufficiently satisficing for selection. When I was on my mission in the early 70s, we were encouraged to show a film called Ancient America Speaks. [7] The LDS Church fired Brigham Young University professor David Wright for his contribution to the volume, and excommunicated both Wright and Metcalfe shortly thereafter. All of these documents are available on the Joseph Smith Papers Project website. I think we ought to be okay with these questions, and not automatically defensive. I wish we could let go of the idea that a person can only be an expert in a particular field if they have a college degree saying they are. Its very sunny in London today and Ive listened too all eleven hours of this interview. A special thanks to Brent for giving up so much of his time to do these episodes, especially some of them as he was feeling very much under the weather. I have that info direct from Mac himself. Do you know if the church took down the names of all the 7th East Press people? Thank you for this very interesting presentation. Other early-19thC religionists were even more literal in their descriptions. Visit with the Skabelund family, 9:30-10:30 am,. He has also served in the United States Air Force (Air National Guard) since 2004. From Spencer Kimballs battle with dementia to Monsons where the hell is that driver, to the insights with Mark E Peterson, Brents influential instructors at the University of Utah. Life seemed euphoric until I was excommunicated from the church because I questioned and I researched. He has already saved her from choking on several occasions. As a teenager and still TBM I read some books on the Hoffman Salamander Letter and events surrounding it. Hofmann really believed he could pull it all off, and maybe it wasnt just the police who thwarted his scheme? Do you think he will ever come completely clean? Nicely done, John. In the past, we often got snippets of information in The Church News, Mark Metcalfe Project Manager - Heavy Lift Division at Western Mechanical Electrical Millwright Services Ltd. Kitchener, Ontario, Canada 500+ connections Also, make sure your second recording matches the first. :-) I really R E A L L Y loved the podcast, and will listen to it all again today. Simply put, I think JSs BoAbr project is an example of JSs *sincerity*, not his fraudulence. It didnt have anything to do with church history or anything you would read in something like the CES letter, but was instead a realization and acceptance that its not me, its the church followed by a complete collapse of everything. In Gnosticism Abraham is not even a real person, the story represents the triumph of spirit over matter and is loaded with hidden symbolic meaning. As Jeremy Runnells (a la Kirby Ferguson) has said, everythings a remix. The triplet Egyptian Alphabet manuscripts and the bound Grammar and Alphabet of the Egyptian Language also elaborate the Katumin narrative. Thanks for this podcast! The 7th East Press is one of the great university newspapers; truly the stars aligned when this group got together. I think youre referring to what has collectively come to be known as the Michigan Relics. James E Talmage wrote quite a bit about them, back in the day. [9], As it began to be clearer that Hofmann was counterfeiting documents, Christensen and Kathy Sheets were murdered in an separate bombs created by Hofmann, and Hofmann himself was injured when a later bomb he created inadvertently exploded. But before Brent could truly move on, he had to deal with the emotional turmoil of knowing that he was associated with Mark Hofmann. :). This unleashed a veritable deluge of Catholic contributions to modern biblical scholarship. Also, I appreciate you bringing up ADD. Its a band called The Lower Lights. Billy Hibbard, for instance, who became a Methodist preacher, recounted: I thought how happy must Jesus Christ have been when he suffered for sinners. There is a newish movement who rejects that the book of mormon ever occurred in South America. Elbert was the managing editor, and Ron the financial guy, so I had the impression that Elbert created the whole thing. Your account of why you didnt pursue a doctorate was extremely touching to me as I absolutely admire those that can do the tedium of historical research. Brent has become one of the foremost scholars in understanding the Book of Abraham. All rights reserved. I dont agree with all the conclusions of your research but the research is a gift to all of us. What are your views on the work of Hugh Nibley? From your perspective, what are the 3-5 best pieces of evidence for the historicity of the bom? In Part 1, Brent talks about his early days in the Church and his time working for Church security. Youve used it well Brent. Three or four episodes were mentioned by John. And you are an example. Or if you have any thoughts on this John? document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Joyce Skabelund October 9, 1938 January 10, 2023 Our mother, grandma, and friend, Joyce Roth Skabelund, 84, departed this life on 10 January 2023. Thanks again for your contribution to Mormon Studies and particularly for your diplomatic engagement with your critics. Unresolved: Release in which this issue/RFE will be addressed. Wrestling for coach Roy Hall at Davison High School in Michigan, Metcalf finished as arguably the #1 overall recruit with a career record of 228-0 with . In Part 3, Brent discusses the aftermath of the Hofmann murders, including the trial and Hofmanns eventual plea deal. If you ever get the chance to talk with Steve Christensens wife and/or Brent Metcalfe again, I would like to hear you explore this dichotomy with them as they are polar opposites. Many years later in his interview with Dehlin, Brent Metcalfe tells of a conversation that he had with Mark E. Peterson where he plainly admits he was lying in his book. Roger that. But Brent seems to do just the opposite.